Moderators: sun137, Phaedrus75, sookmctourie, JP
For MTT's I've noticed that Coop has been without a cash for over 30 games in a row
mattywein wrote: Therefore your would cash alot less often in a FR sng than in heads up.
Quimp wrote:Your assumptions are correct Matty..
The additional reward for playing SNG games with more players is ONLY beneficial if you achieve a TOP 2 place finish, due to the extra time required to finish the game. This is the reason why, earlier in the series, I suggested larger games should only be played as the bankroll grows (because a growing bankroll indicates an increasing skill level).
The additional reward for playing MTT instead of SNG (small, medium or large) is ONLY beneficial if you achieve a TOP 1% finish due to the extra time required to reach this point, as the prizes for the remaining 2% - 10% of the field are only equal to a normal SNG prize fund. This rule applies even if you are choosing a TURBO MTT.
I must restate, however, the point made earlier in the series - we keep MTT in the mix of games because statistically a good player will, in time, with the volume of games played, hit a top 1%/FT finish and the reward will be equal to almost a year normal cash/SNG profit for an equivalent buyin level. It is also for this reason we do not rely on MTT solely for Bankroll Building.
If you examine the potential prize v the time taken however, for SNG (non MTT games), an interesting pattern emerges. Positions 1/2/3 in a single table (9 player game) equate to 2/3/4 in an 18 player game, 3/4/5 in a 27 player game and 5/6/7 in a 45 player game and 8/9/(10-18) in a 180 player game - basically the first 3 places in the single player game become the last 3 places in the multi player games.Therefore you MUST play for a higher place than this is the bigger games, otherwise it is NOT worthwhile.
There is increasing reward in achieving an 'additional place' finish to match the extra risk involved due to the larger field (1st in an 18 player game, 1st/2nd in a 27 player game, 1st/2nd/3rd in a 45 player game, 1st - 7th in a 180 player game).
THere is absolutely NO BENEFIT in playing multi table games if an 'additional place' finish is NOT your aim. You may as well stick with single table SNG because your bottom line profit, in relation to the time you actually play dictates this to be the case.
The most cost effective table?
The answer goes back to the earlier guideline - as the bankroll improves, the skill level will have improved, so play against a larger number of players - because the additional reward FAR OUTWEIGHS the time taken and the 180 player standard blinds game is the best option for the skilled player. The less skilled player should stick to the smaller games as they will produce more consistent reward. The simple logic is the more hands you play, the more chance of a less skilled player making a mistake.
I do not like turbos, but am persuaded by the logic and time factor that they are THE BEST OPTION for a very skilled player, as the reward/time ratio is considerably greater than for a standard game. However, the bankroll guidelines MUST be adhered to for turbo events (a 5 minute turbo requires TREBLE the bankroll) as the additional variance can, in the short term, cause problems for a player who does not have sufficient funds to manage short term fluctuations.


sun137 wrote:STEP 1 - Review the Bankroll Guidelines for each type of game
FL Cash...........................300BB
NL Cash...........................15 x Max Buy in
SNG.................................40 x Buyin + Fee
MTT.................................50 x Buyin + Fee
10 minute Turbo...............Double Bankroll
5 minute Turbo.................Treble Bankroll
Rebuy..............................Treble Bankroll
Turbo Rebuy.....................Multiply the Bankroll factors together (eg 10 minute Turbo Rebuy = 6 x BR)
My gut feel is that I can, but I'm not capable of working the maths out.
This leaves me surprised. I was thinking that since we have a different ROI/win rate in each format, then by definition the number of buy-ins required should be different.
I am rebuilding a bankroll on Pokerstars. I am playing heads up sng's. I have a fairly high skill level at HU and am confident of a 60%+ itm rate playing 1 table at a time. Can I play with a smaller number of buy ins say 20-30 without the risk of going bust increasing? My gut feel is that I can, but I'm not capable of working the maths out.

I am rebuilding a bankroll on Pokerstars. I am playing heads up sng's. I have a fairly high skill level at HU and am confident of a 60%+ itm rate playing 1 table at a time. Can I play with a smaller number of buy ins say 20-30 without the risk of going bust increasing? My gut feel is that I can, but I'm not capable of working the maths out.
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